Hello, friend.
Small talk is something that puts fear into the heart of every introvert or socially awkward human out there.
And while you might dismiss the idea of getting better at small talk as something you don’t need. I think it’s really important to be able to do it, not only because it will get you far in your career, but because it will make you feel less uncomfortable in situations where you’re meeting new people, chatting to someone you don’t know very well and make those interactions that make you want to crawl under a table and hide a thing of the past.
Plus, the more you do it, the less scary it becomes. I want to show you how to master the art of small talk - and it really is an art - so you feel less anxious about meeting new people, more confident to speak to anyone, and so whoever you charm with your new small talking skills is like, “Who was that!? I need to know more.”
What is small talk?
So, what even is small talk anyway?
Here’s what our friend Wikipedia has to say:
“Small talk is an informal type of discourse that does not cover any functional topics of conversation or any transactions that need to be addressed. In essence, it is polite and standard conversation about unimportant things.”
The main situations involving small talk in my life are meeting someone new, so that might be at a networking event, at a baby group or even at my local coffee shop. It might be at the start of a Teams meeting, when I’m one of the first to join. Or when I’m in the break room at work getting a coffee and someone I don’t know very well comes in.
Small talk is actually quite a big part of our life - I feel like if you leave the house, you’re probably going to have to engage in some kind of small talk.
Why are we afraid of small talk?
A lot of us dread small talk, mostly because we anticipate that it will be awkward, or we simply feel like we’re not good at it. And doing something you’re not good at isn’t enjoyable for most people!
Sometimes when I’m having a conversation, I’m almost having a second conversation with myself at the same time, telling me I’m talking about myself too much, that I’m boring the other person, that I’m standing awkwardly, what if there’s something in my teeth?
If you’re an introvert, it might be annoying to spend your limited social energy on conversations that don’t seem important.
There are rules in small talk which can feel inauthentic, like the acceptable answer to “How are you?” from an acquaintance is “Good thanks, how are you?” There’s an unspoken rule that in these interactions you don’t start talking about how you’re actually doing terribly because your dog is ill and work is really stressing you out.
It’s almost more of a ritual than a proper conversation. It’s a performance.
And you know what? More often than not, it’s boring. It’s so easy to tune out of a conversation that is not only unimportant, but unstimulating, especially if you’re neurodivergent.
Why is mastering small talk important?
But, small talk is actually important. It’s the foundation for connecting with other people, building relationships and eventually, fulfilling friendships and relationships.
Small talk gets a bad rap - it seems like there’s a trend on social media for people to suggest that small talk is beneath them. But, guess what - it isn’t.
We need to change our mindset around small talk and reframe it. Its purpose is not to communicate ideas or to solve problems. It’s to build relationships. So don’t go in thinking you’re going to have a deep conversation. It might develop into that, but it probably won’t, especially if it’s your first time meeting someone.
Small talk can also help you, or the person you’re conversing with, to feel more comfortable. Think about going to a doctor’s appointment, for example. You feel much more at ease if the doctor greets you and asks you how you are than if they just get straight into it.
One of my goals in life generally is to make sure no one feels left out. Small talk can let someone know that they aren’t invisible, that they are seen, that people are interested in them.
More selfishly, if you suffer with social anxiety like I do, or even just feel a bit awkward meeting new people, toning your small talk muscles can help you feel less anxious in those situations and more open to situations you may have avoided otherwise for fear of meeting people.
From a work perspective, being a whiz with small talk is an excellent leadership skill, showing that you can connect and build relationships, make people feel at ease and speak with confidence.
And if you don’t feel like you’re good at small talk, don’t worry! It’s a skill that you can build with practice.
So let’s dive into how you can master the art of small talk.
How to get better at small talk
Have some topics lined up
A common concern about small talk is that you’ll run out of things to say. So to avoid that, have some topics lined up.
It might seem a little bit inauthentic, but it’s not. I’m not suggesting you script a conversation, just have some light topics ready in case you need a conversation starter.
Here are a couple of safe bets:
The weather (can you tell that I’m British?)
Food
Hobbies
Film or TV
Work
Travel
The city of town you’re in
There are quite a few articles out there that suggest potential questions to ask people, but honestly most of them sound very robotic and unnatural, so I’m going to advise that you ignore those.
Ask questions
If in doubt, ask questions. People’s favourite topic is often themselves, so getting curious and asking is pretty much always a winning strategy.
Obviously don’t get too personal, but a little curiosity goes a long way - you might find that you have a lot in common.
Notice things
Staying in the realm of curiousity being a winner, keep your eyes peeled and be observant.
If you like someone’s top or shoes or hairstyle, let them know.
Or even a comment about how nice (or horrible!) the food or drink is can be a great ice-breaker
If you mess up, don’t dwell on it
I often find myself start worrying that I’m being boring or that I’m talking about myself halfway through a conversation. This can often get in the way, as you’re now essentially having two conversations at once.
If you notice yourself doing this, or you find yourself in a slightly awkward moment, just move past it and carry on. Stay present in the conversation and you’ll forget about it quickly enough.
And now it’s time for the letters segment of the podcast where you can ask me all your career questions, be it progression, pivoting, or self-confidence - whatever you need help with.
There’s a link to submit your own question in the show notes if you’d like me to answer your dilemma.
Today’s submission is from Becca and she says:
Dear Julia,
I was raised to believe that getting a job in a creative industry wasn’t possible for me, and that if I did pursue a creative career I’d end up broke. So with that in mind, I chose to study economics, and I’ve spent the last decade since graduating climbing the corporate ladder.
I’m in a senior position and make a great salary, but I dislike my job and the person I am at work. I started making prints about a year ago, and it turns out that people actually want to buy them! So my plan now is to save a few months’ salary with a view to quitting my job and making prints full time.
Obviously I’m thrilled and so grateful that people want to pay for my art, but I can’t help feeling angry - at my parents for giving me the mindset that I would never succeed in a creative career, and at myself for not having the self-belief to just go for it anyway.
I feel like I’ve wasted 10 whole years of my life in a job I hate when I didn’t have to, and I could be so much further along by now if I’d just done what I wanted from the start.
How can I get over this anger, and I’d also love to hear any tips you have for going full-time as a business owner.
Thanks!
Becca
Hi Becca!
Firstly, congrats on your new business! Amazing. It’s so fulfilling to not only have a creative outlet, but to know that people see the value in your work and are happy to pay for it.
I really empathise with you, because there’s a lot of grief in realising that you’ve wasted time that you won’t get back. It can be helpful even just to acknowledge that what you’re feeling is grief, so you can process it.
I’m assuming that you’re around your early thirties based on your letter. I think a lot of people have a similar experience and reassess their career around this age, maybe because turning thirty makes us look back on our twenties and evaluate whether we’re where we want to be.
The thing is, you can’t go back, and your younger self couldn’t see into the future. Eighteen-year-old you was making the best decision she could with the information she had. And that decision was to follow the “sensible” route.
The same goes for your parents - I’m sure that they just wanted what they thought was best for you, and a corporate job probably seemed a lot safer than a career in art.
I actually had a conversation with my auntie about this yesterday, because I had a similar experience to you where my parents really encouraged me to pursue a more academic degree because they thought it would lead to a secure job.
Of course, anyone who came of age after 2008 knows that there’s no such thing as a secure job. But for our parents, that was the goal. They didn’t grow up with the internet, or experience all the possibilities that social media has given us to carve out our dream careers. The best outcome for them was a secure, steady job with a stable income.
So while I’m not telling you to forgive your parents, because I only know what you’ve shared of your situation with me, I’m sure that they were trying to be supportive in their own way.
I’d encourage you to switch your focus to the present and future when you find yourself dwelling on the past. You can’t change the last decade of your career, but you still have so many years of work left - why not focus on all the magic you can make happen?
As for tips for going full-time, here are the things that have been most important for me:
Get your financial shit together. Hire an accountant, or purchase some accounting software, understand how much you need to earn to cover your expenses (personal and professional) and make sure you’re turning a profit. Sorry, boring advice, but important!
Go to networking events or join a community (on or offline) and meet other business owners. Yes, this can be beneficial for your business, but having friends who understand what it’s like to run a business will be invaluable. If all of the people close to you are employed, their mindset will be very different to the mindset you need to have as an entrepreneur.
I hope that’s helpful, and I hope you enjoyed this piece! If you did, please reply or leave a comment and let me know how you feel about small talk, and if you have any specific fears or worries about it I’ll do my best to help.
P.S. I'm SO sorry for the sound quality in parts of this episode! I've just purchased a fancy microphone to resolve the issue, so the sound quality should be IMPECCABLE in the next episode.
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